Class system on QE2

[Gerrydthird]

I've been curious lately about what used to be what, and who it used to be for. (I can't remember what her two original class distinctions were called, so I'll label them as Cabin Class and Tourist Class, for upper class and lower class respectively.)

Like, I know that for instance, the Coffee Bar was later refitted as the Queens Grill Lounge; the Cabin Class 736 Club was refitted as the Queens Grill Restaurant; the Double Room has been refitted as the Grand Lounge; the Lookout Bar (a favorite interior) is now a kitchen, etc. I've just been curious as of to what the public rooms were in the beginning, and how they've changed over the years. I have a pretty good idea for most of them, but there's still a lot that I don't know. Also, I'd like to find out what rooms were for what class, and what those rooms/areas are now today.

Btw, would the ship today be considered a single-class ship or a five-class ship (Mauretania, Caronia, Britannia Grill, Princess Grill, Queens Grill)?

[Bob C.]

Gerald, try this post to see the ship when she was new (https://www.theqe2story.com/forum/index.php/topic,355.0.html).  My family and I were onboard in Aug 69, June/July 72, 74, 77 and July 79 so I have a good idea what was and was not original. 

I could go deck by deck but you seemed to have hit most of them.  The sports deck between the mast and funnel (prior to the 1972 penthouses) is probably the biggest external change and then the aft cascading decks from Boat Deck to 1 Deck were not as extended as they are now.   

Also take a look at the "1969 Cutaway 2" on Rob Lightbody's website (http://www.roblightbody.com/liners/qe-2/1969_cutaway_2.htm) and then look at Pride of British Industry: QE2 (http://www.roblightbody.com/liners/qe-2/1969_POBI/index.htm) and "The New Cunard Queen Elizabeth 2" Shipshapes Article http://www.roblightbody.com/liners/qe-2/1969_SHBBLE/qe2_1969_shipshapes_mainpage.htm). 

These should answer a lot of your questions but feel free to ask me if you can't find something.

[Malcolm]

I really must spend more time on Rob's site. There are articles there that I have never seen.

Until they start ripping the cabins out the class boundaries are still very visible (although they aren't actually marked as such - if you didn't know then you would just think the corridors changed). Possibly one of the most obvious places was on One Deck, just forward of cabins 1104 and 1105. There is a watertight door that could be closed across the entire corridor - that marks the change from First to Second. However the corridors get narrower, the décor changes, even the carpet changed.

Another thing on Deck One was that the corridor, amidships, was wide and glamorous. This was by the top cabins. The further you went either forward or astern the more basic it got. Deck Two's Corridor was slightly less wide, Deck three was narrower still and by the time you got down to Decks Four and Five the corridors were serviceable but had none of the opulence of Deck One.

Another obvious sign was in the lifts. "D" lift, the main First Class lift, goes from Boat Deck to Deck Three. The stairs there do go down to Deck Five but they are very small and poky - not like the main stairs on the ship. Some lifts didn't stop at certain decks because there was no reason for anyone travelling in that lift to have to get off there. For example "A" lift didn't stop at Quarter Deck, partly because that was through the galley but also because Quarter Deck was First Class - A stairway was built to serve the Second (and Third) Class of Decks Four and Five and to take passengers from there to the Britannia Restaurant.

[Gerrydthird]

Hey you guys, thanks, that helps a lot actually! I still just have one more question though, it's more or less a visual thing since that's how I am, but would there be a list somewhere showing the rooms available to each class?

Like, this for example:

Cabin Class
----------------
736 Club
Coffee Bar
Queens Room
_________________________________
Tourist Class
-----------------
Colombia Restaurant
Tourist Library

Etc.

[Malcolm]

would there be a list somewhere showing the rooms available to each class?

I don't know of one. A question would be during what era? Rooms certainly changed their function although I don't know about their class. Things like the Second Class Library did become the Computer Learning Centre - I don't think that was given a class but was open to all. I am not certain that the CLC didn't have a class, just that it didn't on my first time onboard (when there were still classes).

Also the present passenger launderette on Three Deck was the Second Class Launderette, The first Class Launderette was at the front of One Deck (now gone) and, I think, there was also one on Deck Five (again gone).

[Rob Lightbody]

My understanding is that the computer centre on Deck Two was built in place of the 2^nd Class Library. However I don't know what date that was done or even if the area was used for something else between those two functions.

My question at this point is what was the Card Room (Quarter Deck) before it became the Card Room? Did it have a previous incarnation? My understanding is that Quarter Deck was a First Class preserve. Boat Deck couldn't have been entirely First Class because of Double Up at the stern; The Theatre Balcony was First Class but was the reading room at the front for Second Class use?

... but the class-split was never enforced on board, was it?

[Malcolm]

The Class System was rarely enforced. Knee-height signs reminding people of what class were used - and very easily ignored I suppose!

I was never on her when the class system was in operation (the closest I ever got was a cruise when the class divide was only on transatlantics). However I wonder how many people did ignore those signs. I suspect that, in the early 70s, the vast majority of second class passengers would have stayed in their allotted area and would not have dreamt of disobeying a sign that told them not to pass.

[Isabelle Prondzynski]

Bit like most of us felt about the Queen's Grill Lounge, I suspect. I never went in when I was not a Grills passenger... and never felt entirely comfortable there when I was a Britannia Grill or Princess Grill passenger. The one time we went Queen's Grill, we actually sat there quite a lot, but we never missed it on subsequent voyages when we were not in Queen's Grill and never went near the place...

[Michael Gallagher]

Please find attached a document I produced for myself when researching the whole class thing on QE2. I personally think that the most influential QE2 decision Sir Basil Smallpeice (Chairman of Cunard 1965 - 1971) made was making QE2 a two-class ship.

[Rob Lightbody]

Thats an amazingly comprehensive document!  Thank you!

[Malcolm]

Bit like most of us felt about the Queen's Grill Lounge, I suspect. I never went in when I was not a Grills passenger... and never felt entirely comfortable there when I was a Britannia Grill or Princess Grill passenger.

I can sympathise with that When we were in Britannia or Princess Grills we would use the lounge for afternoon tea (their scones were far better than you got in the Queens Room ) but, other than that, we didn't use it. When we were eating in Queens Grill we'd have our preprandial drinks there and our coffee afterwards. If we were sitting with people we wanted to talk with then we could spend the entire evening there.

The one time we went Queen's Grill, we actually sat there quite a lot, but we never missed it on subsequent voyages when we were not in Queen's Grill...

Once I'd been on a cruise in the grills and able to use the QGL I only went back to dining in the Caronia on two cruises after that. I don't think that I did miss afternoon tea there 

[Malcolm]

Thats an amazingly comprehensive document!  Thank you!

That is a document I want to spend a lot more than the ten minutes I've got spare at the moment. Thank you

[Scott Ebersold]

This is really, great!  Thank you.

[Bob C.]

The Class System was rarely enforced. Knee-height signs reminding people of what class were used - and very easily ignored I suppose!

It's hard to remember specifically but I do remember it being ingrained in my brother, 2 sisters and I (our ages ranging from 3-16 from 1969-1979)  that there were certain places on the ship we could not go due to the class system being enforced.  I vaguely recall the knee high signs but I vividly remember being scolded by a steward for venturing up the stairs to the penthouse suites in 1977.

[Malcolm]

I vividly remember being scolded by a steward for venturing up the stairs to the penthouse suites in 1977.

One time, about 1996 but I can't remember exactly, my mother was up there and I was in a cabin on One Deck. The butler at the time, Geoffrey, was very suspicious (but still extremely courteous) of me until he knew who I was. Once he knew that I had a reason to be up there he was incredibly welcoming. I've visited other passengers up there but have never seen that level of security this decade.